Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:02 Welcome to Chicago Musician. I'm your host, Shawn Stengel. O Frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!. It's time for our first full episode with a guest. Yeah. Enough of this blathering by myself. I wanna talk to people, see what's going on. So my first guest is Linda van Dyke. She's a colleague and friend, and what we in the Broadway pit world call a reed doubler. We'll have her explain. Welcome to Episode 2 of Chicago Musician. It's Friday, March 11th, 2022. We'll get to our conversation with Linda van Dyke in just a few minutes. But first, I'd like to start with a question and then an appreciation. First, the question: What do you think you might be doing when you're 94 years old? Well, if your name is Herbert Blomstedt, it means you were conducting the Chicago Symphony Orchestra last night, leading a mammoth, muscular Bruckner Symphony #4. . . never cracking the score open, by the way!
Speaker 0 00:01:33 And this was just the second half of the concert. In the first half, you conducted a Mozart piano concerto. And Maestro Blomstedt is, you guessed it, 94 years young! Truly remarkable. I mean, when he walked on stage, he's pretty frail looking, you know, he is 94. But man, there was no doubt who was in control of that performance. Really musical and just enough information for the band to just play the lights out of this thing. Part of what was cool about it for me, although I'm not 94, it may seem like it. . . The first piece I ever heard the Chicago Symphony play in person was Bruckner 4 in Minneapolis. Now I was a student at the University of Minnesota. This was just after the war. We've had a lot of wars. So you figure out which one. And I was a trumpet player at the time. In college, I played the trumpet.
Speaker 0 00:02:45 That's kind of remarkable to think about, you know, 14 hours a day. Anyhow, I think because my teacher, David Baldwin was the head of the brass department, and you know, I'm sure a worshiper at the altar of Bud Herseth, the God of trumpet players, that somehow that's how I got a ticket to this concert. I think on a Sunday afternoon. Anyhow, it was in the Solti era. And I'm telling you, they blew my hair off. That's how I lost my hair. I knew it was sort of premature. But I had never heard anything like that in my life. I remember thinking at the time, holy crap, you think rock concerts are loud?? Listen to this brass section!! I mean, this was the glory days of Solti and the Chicago brass with Bud Herseth leading the trumpets and Dale Clevenger and the horns from hell.
Speaker 0 00:03:46 I mean, the end of that symphony is horns up, you know, as loud as you can play, all four of them. And, uh, uh, just, uh, beyond thrilling. I just got chills right now. Just thinking back to that sound. And the cool thing about Bruckner is, if you're willing to wait for it, cuz it's, you know, these are big sprawling symphonies, but the whole symphony starts with the simplest call from the horn. Um, there's sort of this shimmering, uh, I don't know, some E flat, uh, it's in the strings, thankfully. That's why it's not on piano, but then the horn plays [theme].
Speaker 0 00:04:44 And this whole like 20 minute movement is based just on that theme. And ends in aurar with the horns going da, da, da!!! Chills. I feel a little bit like Carl Haas, Adventures in Good Music. Remember him? Very popular radio host for years and years. I used to listen to on WFMT. And he would always play little samples of the music and explain them. So I aspire to be, you know, one iota of what he did. So how many years later, to hear the CSO again, play that piece and really very differently with Maestro Blomstedt. I don't know how to say his name. Is it Hairbert Bloomschtedt? Or is it Herbert Blomstead? I think he was born in the U.S., but he grew up in Sweden. So you can say it however you want. Anyhow, they knocked it out of the park. And they also did a Mozart piano concerto before it. The soloist Martin Helmchen
Speaker 0 00:05:59 Oh, magic fingers. I was somehow like six rows directly in front of the piano. . . just feathery and then like thunder. Really a wonderful performance. And he gave an encore and it was quite moving. Actually, he said a little beforehand that it was for the people of Oo-kra-een-a as he pronounced it, or Ukraine. And then he played a slow movement of a Mozart piano concerto, actually a piano Sonata, which I have attempted to play in the past. And I don't remember it sounding remotely like this!!! Very musical, emotional performance. Bravo, Maestro Helmchen. I haven't heard him before in person, but I will definitely seek him out again.
Speaker 0 00:06:57 And this leads me to what I'm calling an appreciation. If you're daring enough or diluted enough to call your podcast, Chicago musician, then I guess it only makes sense to talk about the Chicago musicians at the absolute top of the heap. And that is the Chicago symphony over the last two seasons. But especially since the orchestra started performing again, after the pandemic shutdown through the force of my own radiant personality, along with the generosity of a couple really good friends, only the second part of this statement being true. I've been lucky enough to attend more than my share of performances at orchestra hall of the Chicago symphony with very mystery, um, Myra Muti and others. Um, and I just wanna say this orchestra is the finest in the world. Come on, fight me. I mean, I've heard Berlin and Berlin. I've heard New York and New York.
Speaker 0 00:08:07 I've heard, um, the Che Gabo in Amsterdam. I've heard some good orchestras. I'm no expert, but hearing this band many times in a short span of time, playing a wide, uh, repertoire, they are exquisite, astounding, thrilling, uh, just mechanical wizards and musical geniuses. I, I mean, I know I'm fawning, but you've gotta go hear them. You have to go hear them. And if you can't hear them in person, I think they have live broadcast, live broadcast, a weekly broadcast on w F M T of their concerts. I mean, it's so I've been so uplifted, uh, sitting there listening to them. I don't know what planet they're from, but it's a great one. I mean their, their musicality, their precision, their pride of ensemble is really top notch. I mean that what a lousy descriptor, right? But it's thrilling. And the, the performers, the soloists they get, uh, I've heard Ray Chen on violin. Mitsuko UTA like a butterfly playing Mozart on the piano. I heard, uh, Joel Harvey, this radiant soprano do Barbara's Knoxville summer of 1915. She was a brilliant singer, but a totally beguiling actress performer to just so embodied the warmth of the, the piece and on and on and on and on. So I wanna salute the Chicago symphony orchestra and Myro moody and all involved for just thrilling music, making every time out of the gate. It's an honor and a thrill to sit there and listen to them. Bravo.
Speaker 0 00:10:23 Well, now it's finally time for our guests. If we've been at the top of the heap, well, now we're going to the bottom or at least more familiar territory for me. The pits of the Broadway musical and our guest today is my friend and colleague Linda Vandyke. Welcome.
Speaker 3 00:10:43 Hello, Sean. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 0 00:10:45 I'm so excited to get to talk with you and so glad that you're willing to be my Guinea pig. In my first episode,
Speaker 3 00:10:52 I was tickled when I received the call and you asked me
Speaker 0 00:10:55 Yeah, well, after like seven people turned me down, I mean, that's not true, but so, um, so Linda, yes, I said in the intro that you're a read doubler. I am let's start there. How do we know each other from in a pit we've played in shows a few times and your gig is what
Speaker 3 00:11:17 Well in the pit, my gig is, as you said, he re Dubler and I'm pretty sure you and I met on the first go round of wicked. The sit down that was here in Chicago.
Speaker 0 00:11:29 That seems, I think at least playing together. Yes. That was probably the first time.
Speaker 3 00:11:33 Yes. I don't have much of a memory beyond that. Um, or prior to that, I should say
Speaker 0 00:11:39 A memory at all, or about me,
Speaker 3 00:11:41 About you, about you. Okay. But my memories are fuzzy. I'm learning the older I get that it's, um, snapshots I have as opposed to like long stories of, of remembrances, but with regards to being a RedR, um, I'm a saxophone and clarinetist, uh, had I pursued flute and Basoon, I probably would've gotten more gigs, but I've done plenty with the instruments that I do play.
Speaker 0 00:12:07 What's your main acts?
Speaker 3 00:12:09 My main acts is clarinet. That's what I majored in, in college. But I added the saxophone because I really wanted to be in the jazz band. And that was the only spot that was opened was baritone sax. So I was like, okay, sure. I'll learn that.
Speaker 0 00:12:23 Do you play other
Speaker 3 00:12:24 Saxes? I do.
Speaker 0 00:12:26 Do you get to play them much in pits?
Speaker 3 00:12:29 No. The only other saxophone that I've played are the tenor on the show, Chicago and soprano, same show. Um, but I've never played. No, I take that back. I was gonna say I've never played Alto, but I finally got a chance to do that up in do county.
Speaker 0 00:12:44 Oh, nice.
Speaker 3 00:12:44 On drowsy chaperone. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:12:46 I mean, for my friends and relatives, listening to this, it's hard to play a lot of different instruments and have to play them well enough to, and usually in the pit you're by yourself. I mean often it's you and no one else playing what you're playing.
Speaker 3 00:13:03 Correct. I've been fortunate to do few shows where there have been four to five saxophones that was many, many years ago nowadays it's one
Speaker 0 00:13:13 That was, that was standard Broadway writing. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, there'd be five read players and they all played five instruments. Right. So you had like this orchestra of woodwinds. Yes. And sometimes it would be four flute players and a Piccolo or, you know, three clarinets and add a saxophone. I mean, so yeah, we've shrunk
Speaker 3 00:13:31 Very, very much so. And a colleague of mine, somebody we both know Jim Gareto I know just played nine instruments on Avita out in, at the jury lane. That's what it's come to now
Speaker 0 00:13:44 Nine
Speaker 3 00:13:45 Nine.
Speaker 0 00:13:47 And that wasn't German. Right? That was an
Speaker 3 00:13:49 Actual number. It was an actual number.
Speaker 0 00:13:50 Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we'll talk about that at some point. I don't understand the economics of that. So just hire a second player. I'm sure it's the same cost once you play all the doubles and uh, that's our world
Speaker 3 00:14:02 Though. It is, it's a
Speaker 0 00:14:04 Sadly, it's a crazy, you know, I've made my living in pits, mostly paying keyboards, which means often I'm playing fake strings mm-hmm <affirmative> or I'm playing third clarinet to fill out a cord. Exactly. You know, so I have, I have a lot of mixed feelings about replacing real players. Yeah. And, and also realizing the economics of we, most of the smaller Chicago theaters can't afford 15 players in the pit.
Speaker 3 00:14:34 No, they cannot. And I understand that to a certain degree, but with the case of the nine musicians, as you said, if you could have just hired a second read player, you, you, would've had more richness with two players playing those instruments instead
Speaker 0 00:14:47 Of, and two people get to make a living.
Speaker 3 00:14:49 Exactly.
Speaker 0 00:14:51 You know, it's hard enough. This is a very competitive world. Very, you know, there's very few, there's a lot fewer touring shows than there used to be and a lot fewer production. So, um, it's always been hard to get these jobs. Mm-hmm <affirmative> and so I, I'm pretty sure you're like me. I wish I'd worked a lot, lot more, but I've, I've worked and, and lucky very, to work and play with great players, fun players.
Speaker 3 00:15:20 I wanna share a story with you about the very first show I played. And at the time I didn't realize how fortunate I was.
Speaker 0 00:15:29 Okay. Due
Speaker 3 00:15:30 Time back in college, I was asked to play for a touring production of cabaret with Joel gray as the MC.
Speaker 0 00:15:39 Okay. So did, did you ever get to do a show with somebody? Good.
Speaker 3 00:15:43 <laugh> okay.
Speaker 0 00:15:44 Joking.
Speaker 3 00:15:46 Uh, actually I got to do it twice and I, at the time I had no idea. I, I was not a musical theater, you know, uh, huge fan. I, I didn't watch a lot of them growing up. Right.
Speaker 0 00:16:01 You, you wanted to do jazz, right. Be a
Speaker 3 00:16:04 Jazz. I wanted, no, I wanted to be a pop star. <laugh>
Speaker 0 00:16:07 Oh, excellent. Yes. That will be our next follow
Speaker 3 00:16:09 Up. Okay. Yes, we'll get there later. Um, but when I got asked to do the show by Kenny SLO, I, it was a gig and I was happy to do it. And at the time I thought, yeah, this was fun, but I don't know that this is something I want to pursue. And when I came back and got my first show, 20 years later, that that's when I finally realized what great fun and what a challenge it was. And
Speaker 0 00:16:35 Do you remember what your, um, breakdown of instruments was for cabaret?
Speaker 3 00:16:40 I know I was on the low reads. That's why I was hired. So it would've been Barry and bass clarinet, and maybe clarinet. It wouldn't have been anything else cuz at the time I didn't play anything else.
Speaker 0 00:16:49 Okay. But it's cabaret. So you could have sucked and it would've sounded like realistic <laugh> or well, maybe not. Okay. So
Speaker 3 00:16:56 Very true.
Speaker 0 00:16:57 Yeah. Back me up. I wanted to be a pop star. <laugh> okay. I know this. I know about you. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I've heard at least one album of you that you wrote and were singing on. Yes. Is there more than
Speaker 3 00:17:12 One? There's not. Okay. It was a one shot deal <laugh> okay.
Speaker 0 00:17:16 But really good. Thank you. I wanna say, and this is before I knew you fell. Yeah. And sort of my introduction to you, I didn't know you were a singer and or a composer and a ranger, blah, blah, blah. So very impressive. So take me back to what you were thinking when you were younger.
Speaker 3 00:17:32 Well, I, I don't know if I should admit this, but I was a very huge Barry Manalow fan.
Speaker 0 00:17:40 You can admit anything on Chicago musician. Oh, thank you. I'll edit out this stuff. I don't like
Speaker 3 00:17:45 <laugh> I, um, I loved the, the variety of compositions that he had and I really UN felt like I understood the arranging that went into all that he did. Mm-hmm <affirmative> um, but I also, I'm a teenager. You get enamored with being famous and I'm doing my air quotes. Um, that seemed to be something that really motivated me now at my age, that is something that I have zero desire for.
Speaker 0 00:18:20 But I, well, you and I are grizzled and jaded now.
Speaker 3 00:18:23 Yes we are. But
Speaker 0 00:18:24 We, even though we sound pleasant,
Speaker 3 00:18:25 We yeah. And in this time of social media and such, I'm so glad I'm not famous because yeah. All the dirty dark secrets that I carry
Speaker 0 00:18:34 Well, but now you're on this podcast, so well, yeah. Straight to the top.
Speaker 3 00:18:38 Yeah, I know. I know. Um, but that is something that motivated me. I think I wanted to do it to validate something within me, but I also had music in me that needed to come out and I, I'm not one of those writers, composers that writes every day. I, I had a project in mind and I, I had an end goal with it. I really hoped it was gonna hit the big time. And
Speaker 0 00:19:06 I would, um, so what age are we talking here? Teenage
Speaker 3 00:19:08 MI not, um, well it all started when I was a teenager. Sure. That I wanted it, but I did the CD when I was in my thirties, which is probably way too old to begin with to even pursue that career.
Speaker 0 00:19:18 There's no such thing as too old. Thank you. 94 year old. How about
Speaker 3 00:19:23 Bloom? Yeah, that's true. I know I should keep that in mind,
Speaker 0 00:19:26 So, okay. Let's go back farther then. So where did you grow up?
Speaker 3 00:19:31 Um, Ferguson, Missouri. A suburb of St. Louis. That's
Speaker 0 00:19:35 Right. You and I are trans transplanted. We are Cubs fans. Yes. So how did this happen? I'm from Minnesota diehard twins fan mm-hmm <affirmative>. How did you escape St. Louis and not,
Speaker 3 00:19:47 Well, when I escaped St. Louis, I was a big football Cardinals fan. Okay. But I wasn't a baseball fan at all. Okay. Then I lived in Wrigleyville, listened to WGN radio, listened to games as I was going to. And from all the private teaching at the different schools, fell in love with the broadcasters and got into it. And now I'm a Cubs fan to the great dismay of all my St. Louis.
Speaker 0 00:20:15 I'm actually, I've now given up all sports,
Speaker 3 00:20:18 Have
Speaker 0 00:20:18 You? This is yeah, because since when, well, I'm very, very disillusioned with the current state of professional sports by the best team. Like the people on your team this year are on the other team the next year. And it's all about money and all that sort of stuff. But also I realized in sports, everybody loses except for one. Right. Right. And if you're from Minnesota, you know, the one is not, you <laugh> like, you never win. So I'm tired of like always losing, but mostly it's the disillusionment with the, um, economics of professional sports right now.
Speaker 3 00:20:54 I'm with you on that. And I keep saying, I'm gonna be done. And then I kind of get sucked back in and
Speaker 0 00:20:59 I love watching a game. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:21:00 And you and I have been to, yes.
Speaker 0 00:21:02 Mm-hmm <affirmative> for some, a couple, some at least, at least great. We saw the last one we saw. We did a great comeback. I can't remember anything about it, but remember we were playing the reds and yes. And we were down like eight to five and we couldn't, every time we got close, they'd hit three more home runs. And we're like, well, it's a nice day, at least here in Rigley. Yeah. And somehow we came back and won it, like in the bottom of the ninth. Yeah. It was a great game.
Speaker 3 00:21:27 It's a wonderful
Speaker 0 00:21:28 Game. That's enough details people. Yeah. This is one of the funny things about me. I grew up in a sports household and so I've never seen any old movies. If, if the TV was on, on a Saturday, it was the stars or the Vikings or the gophers or the twins, always the games mm-hmm <affirmative>. Um, so when I was on tour a lot in the nineties, my friend, Jim Moore, who's a, uh, James Moore now a big, uh, Broadway music director, conductor mm-hmm <affirmative>, we've been friends for years and toured together. He and I, he went to Indiana, but he also was a huge sports fan. So when we were touring all of the touring guys or the locals would always be amazed that like the two gay guys in the touring band were like, okay, you wanna talk basketball? Okay. Yeah, come on, come at us. And we, we, you know, there was no, we're not like fair weather fans. Right. I know like more rules about sports than a musician should know. <laugh> it's a real waste of my so-called talents. I don't know where that was leaving me. Anyhow. So we're Cubs fans.
Speaker 3 00:22:35 We are
Speaker 0 00:22:35 Very weather and I'm still a twins fan. Actually the first year I came to Chicago, the twins won the world series 1987. Oh, for the first time ever. It was crazy.
Speaker 3 00:22:46 Well, and being a Chicago Cubs fan, I'm not a Chicago white Sox hater.
Speaker 0 00:22:52 I,
Speaker 3 00:22:53 I, to test the Cardinals way more. <laugh>
Speaker 0 00:22:56 Exactly. Well, we beat the Cardinals that was for you in 1987 twins beat the
Speaker 3 00:23:01 Cardinals. That's right.
Speaker 0 00:23:02 Right. And then we beat Atlanta in 1991, the greatest world series ever. Oh. Where the twins won one to nothing. And Jack Morris pitched all 10 innings and they won on a walk off, you know,
Speaker 3 00:23:15 See, I really admire how much you know about this stuff. This, these are the kinds of things my brain does not retain.
Speaker 0 00:23:20 I, I practice this speech for, for weeks leading up to this thing. So anyhow, St. Louis Ferguson, this is my question. Were you like a little music superstar when you were in grade school, when you were
Speaker 3 00:23:33 Very much? I singer I learned no clarinet. I learned clarinet as a fourth grader and took to it very quickly. Uh, I can't remember. I think my big solo at the end of my fourth grade year, um, was midnight cowboy <laugh> and I was taken around to the other grade schools by my teacher to kind of show off. Do you know Chuck Larkin? Yes. He and I both
Speaker 0 00:23:57 Grew up
Speaker 3 00:23:58 Chicago.
Speaker 0 00:23:58 Yeah. Keyboard player, wonderful
Speaker 3 00:23:59 Music. And he's from St. Louis as well. Okay. And he was a star saxophone player at the time. Didn't know this about Chuck, did you,
Speaker 0 00:24:07 All of us keyboard players used to play
Speaker 3 00:24:09 Some mill play. Exactly. And, um, so we were kind of taken around and shown off. And by the time I was in sixth grade, my big number was flight of the bumblebee. And I knew at that time, this is what I wanted to do with my life. I wanted to be a musician and my parents never bulked at that. They supported everything that I did. And,
Speaker 0 00:24:28 Um, are they musicians?
Speaker 3 00:24:31 My dad played the trumpet and practiced with me when I was very young. And I think that helped a great deal. And there came a point. I outplayed him and my mom, she sang a bit, my grandfather was a church organist and my grandmother was, um, a soloist in churches. So that's kind of where, and my aunt, her, my grandmother's sister wrote, um, jingles for, uh, halls in Kansas city. She, she worked on the Plaza.
Speaker 0 00:24:59 So you have a little bit, bit music. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I don't have much of any really. Yeah. I mean a few distant relatives, but you know, most of my family experience was church choir.
Speaker 0 00:25:11 Okay. You know? Yeah. Minnesota Lutheran, Norwegian German. Very. So we sang all verses very loudly, you know? Yeah. So a lot of singing, but not a lot of schooled musicianship. Yeah. So I don't know where I came out of, but yeah. I started early too. Yeah. My, I have an older brother and a younger sister and we all agreed or were forced into, I can't remember what it was taking piano lessons, Uhhuh <affirmative> somewhere around, you know, first, second, third grade. And I think the deal with our parents is we, we had to do it for a year and then if we didn't like it, we could quit.
Speaker 3 00:25:48 Okay.
Speaker 0 00:25:49 And I think all of us took more, much more than that.
Speaker 3 00:25:52 Well, after I started clarinet, I really enjoyed piano and my grandparents and my aunt on my dad's side got together and bought an upright for me. Oh, nice. Nice. And I had five years of lessons that it was when my grade school band director, who was also my piano teacher. And I remember my mom took me twice a week, once for a lesson. And once for a theory class that I did with others, I Ooh,
Speaker 0 00:26:16 Highfalutin
Speaker 3 00:26:17 It. Yeah. The, I think the theory class was a dollar and the piano lesson was $5 way back then. Wow. Theory. I, I really learned a lot. I it's amazing how much stayed with me and how in college. I was so grateful for what I'd learned at that young
Speaker 0 00:26:35 Age. So we still haven't got to you the singer. How did that occur?
Speaker 3 00:26:40 I wanted to sing when I was in high school, but I was so entrenched in being an instrumentalist. Um, when I got to college, I joined a band that was a wedding band at the time. And I, I worked on my singing. I studied with ed Farron. I don't know if you're familiar. The Feron brothers, ed and Fred, their twins. Oh,
Speaker 0 00:27:02 Love them. No, never heard
Speaker 3 00:27:03 Of them. Okay. They were part of the Arbor's, um,
Speaker 0 00:27:07 Trees.
Speaker 3 00:27:08 <laugh> no Ann Arbor, Michigan. They were from Michigan. Okay. So they were called the ARBs and it was, uh, ed and Fred. And I don't know the other two guys, but it was a male vocal quartet. And I studied with ed for many years and he's near and dear, I, I still miss him. Um, but he helped me along with my singing. And then I started to write stuff and I sang in this wedding band for 10 years, uh, ended up leading the band for, for a good portion of it. Um, that's what really got me into singing. And that was kind of the only place that I did it. And then with the CD, and I've never done much with it since
Speaker 0 00:27:45 I know, but like I've never done wedding bands. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I totally admire the crew that does, because talk it's,
Speaker 3 00:27:53 It's hard. It's hard. It's hard work. It's hard. Yeah. It's brutal that when it, it came time to disband the band, I had to make a decision. I was teaching way a lot of lessons and doing the band on the weekends and I was exhausted. So one had to go and I found that the teaching filled me more than the band stuff. So I let the band go focused on teaching. And that's when I got back into musicals.
Speaker 0 00:28:19 Um, some people don't have that choice. No. I mean, sometimes that gig is the money gig.
Speaker 3 00:28:25 Mm-hmm <affirmative> oh, it was a great money gig for me. It really was. But I was making about the same amount of money doing the teaching. Granted it was over a course of a week as opposed to a one night or two nights on a weekend. But again, I had to choose what felt more fulfilling.
Speaker 0 00:28:43 It's it's weird with the age of iPods and you know, playlists now, wedding bands disappeared overnight. Almost,
Speaker 3 00:28:52 Almost.
Speaker 0 00:28:53 There's a few people who want live musicians now mm-hmm, <affirmative> mostly you plug in your iPod and
Speaker 3 00:28:58 Sadly, yeah.
Speaker 0 00:29:00 It, I, I like you. I know a lot of people who've made a decent living. Mm-hmm <affirmative> a hard living, I think, but a decent living, playing weddings and gigs all, all year long.
Speaker 3 00:29:12 Yeah. The ones that are still out there now, they they're great at promoting. Um, and, and they, they have great bands, great singers and, and I very much admire their ability to stay alive in this market.
Speaker 0 00:29:28 Yeah. And I appreciate the clients still were yes. Willing to fork out for live musicians. Yes. That's in every venue. Mm-hmm <affirmative> music theater too. Yeah. So, um, I remember most, I know we played wicked a lot together. Mm-hmm <affirmative> although we were on the opposite sides of the pit. Yes. Wicked played here in Chicago, late two thousands, like 7, 8, 9, somewhere
Speaker 3 00:29:52 In there. I think it started in five maybe.
Speaker 0 00:29:54 Yeah. But RA almost four years. Yes. And, um, so a lot of us were lucky enough to play it and it was a, I mean, it was so fun to play.
Speaker 3 00:30:02 Oh, I, I was not the original person on the book. I was, oh, me
Speaker 0 00:30:06 Either. I was not at all original <laugh>
Speaker 3 00:30:09 You're original in my heart shop.
Speaker 0 00:30:11 Thank you, Linda. That's why you're here.
Speaker 3 00:30:12 Yeah. Um, I was beyond grateful when I was asked to sub by the, the player that had the chair and I, I have never worked harder to go into sub than I have for that show, because at the time it had already been here two years. And as you know, everybody knows how it's supposed to sound in the pit. Yes. And they wanted to sound like that every single time. They don't want it to sound different. So I, I tried to go in as seamlessly as possible. And I guess I did a good enough job cuz I was asked back.
Speaker 0 00:30:47 Yeah, ladies and gentlemen, if you have not ever been a sub in a hit, let me tell you it's, it's brutal.
Speaker 3 00:30:56 It's one of the most stressful things ever.
Speaker 0 00:30:58 You don't get rehearsal. No, you get a book. You have to learn it. You get to go and sit and listen to someone else, play it. Maybe once, twice, now we get recordings usually that you can play along with. Right. But then when it's your turn to sub, it's a real show with the real audience and everyone else in the pit has played it 700 times and they're relaxed and they're not thinking. Right. So anything that you do,
Speaker 3 00:31:22 That's just a little bit different
Speaker 0 00:31:24 Deviates from the norm ears perk up and heads raise and, and um, yeah, it's pretty brutal. And you, uh, I've been lucky, the chances, the lucky chances I got in my career and you have to get lucky to get someone to yes. Want you to sub or ask you to sub, but then you have to deliver
Speaker 3 00:31:48 And 100%, if
Speaker 0 00:31:49 Yeah, if you fail, like the first time you might be done, mm-hmm <affirmative>
Speaker 3 00:31:54 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:31:54 There's not a lot of forgiveness
Speaker 3 00:31:56 In it. People that that's happened to.
Speaker 0 00:31:59 Yeah. Wonderful,
Speaker 3 00:32:00 Wonderful
Speaker 0 00:32:01 Musicians, amazing musicians. Yeah. But playing in a pit is a different art.
Speaker 3 00:32:05 Very much. There's
Speaker 0 00:32:06 A different skill set to playing eight times a week, the same thing or aiming for the same thing. And a lot of people, uh, I have, I'm sure you get the same reaction to, how do you play in the same show? Yep. Over and over. And there's a truth to that observation
Speaker 3 00:32:25 There is. And that's what I thought back in the day when I did cabaret, why would I wanna do this eight times a week? But for me it's I wanna play my best show this time. Yes. And then the next day I wanna play my best show this time, every time you wanna play your best show.
Speaker 0 00:32:44 Yeah. For me, what I enjoy and wicked was a great example because it, you know, it was as high profile as it gets mm-hmm <affirmative> and thus the best pay and the best players and, and high expectations. But when you're in year four of that, everyone's played it hundreds of times. Mm-hmm <affirmative> but the level of relaxation you have allows you to just play it.
Speaker 3 00:33:08 Very true.
Speaker 0 00:33:09 And for me, at least the best shows are the ones where you're just in a zone. Yeah. Doesn't even occur to you that you should be nervous, but you're still paying attention and, and everyone's just playing it. It's it. When you only play a concert three times, you never get to that re relaxed. So do you think that's true?
Speaker 3 00:33:31 Very, very true. I, I love and I've had conversations with other musicians about, um, I personally kinda like the process leading through, you know, the tech and the sits pro the VL pro, um, and then the previews. But then I had a conversation with somebody else who said, no, I, I don't like that. I just like it. When we start going, everything's done everything's in, in place. And we just play
Speaker 0 00:33:59 I'm with you. I like the whole process. I like the process. You know, you, you practice it by yourself, then you add the actors. Yeah. And you hear these incredible voices mm-hmm <affirmative> and then you add the scenery and the tech and it sometimes it's frustrating and mind blowing.
Speaker 3 00:34:14 Yes.
Speaker 0 00:34:15 But, uh, most of us who play in that world also appreciated,
Speaker 3 00:34:20 Well, the first show that I got to do post my wedding band was the show Fosse. That show was also, it was such a special group of musicians and we all played together so well and had such a great attitude about what we did. And we were led by the compar, um, incomparable, um, whatever the word is, Don York, who is no longer with us, but he was an amazing conductor for us and just had a great vibe. Um,
Speaker 0 00:34:53 I, I remember vividly, that was early on in my sort of joining the world of Broadway musicals. Mm-hmm <affirmative> and, and I went to see that show and I still have a note in my head as that being the best sounding live show I ever saw. I mean, they mixed. It's
Speaker 3 00:35:11 Good to know. So yeah.
Speaker 0 00:35:14 You know, amazing. And you know, it's music all over the, all over the genres because it's Fosse dance. Yes. But,
Speaker 3 00:35:22 But many different styles.
Speaker 0 00:35:23 What did you play in that one?
Speaker 3 00:35:24 I played bass Barry and clarinet. Those three mm-hmm
Speaker 0 00:35:31 <affirmative>. How many read players? You remember? Four
Speaker 3 00:35:32 Mm-hmm <affirmative> oh, cool. Yeah. It was four. It was just terrific. Yeah,
Speaker 0 00:35:37 That sounded amazing. I remember that. And I saw spring awakening in New York mm-hmm <affirmative> and that was when it was like Liam, Michelle and, um, oh
Speaker 3 00:35:45 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:35:45 Like original cast. And that show blew my mind as for what it sounded like. Yeah. Unbelievable.
Speaker 3 00:35:52 I've never been able to play that show, but
Speaker 0 00:35:54 Yeah. Well Meer because I don't play violin or cello or,
Speaker 3 00:35:57 Or
Speaker 0 00:35:58 Anything. Right. Or anything real, apparently
Speaker 3 00:35:59 I know. Well, I would've loved to have played Hamilton, but there were no horns on that gig.
Speaker 0 00:36:04 So no, get me started on Hamilton.
Speaker 3 00:36:06 <laugh> maybe forget I brought it up. That's
Speaker 0 00:36:08 Right. Exactly. Oh, there's a lot. I have to forget. But, um, what was I gonna say? Oh, I remember a show. We did play together with Chicago, which I know you've played a lot.
Speaker 3 00:36:19 Love that show.
Speaker 0 00:36:20 I have not, but I subbed on it once and it's one of my
Speaker 3 00:36:22 Favorites. I do remember that. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:36:24 And for me it was, that was when Tom Wopat was playing
Speaker 3 00:36:28 Billy. Oh, he was Billy. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:36:30 And I was subbing, I think for Maria Hoick sch noble. Yeah. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And the pianos for those of you that don't know this incarnation of Chicago, all the musicians are on stage. Yes. Like in a bandstand, love them, but the actors actually come down stairways and through the band and up through the things. And this was funny, cuz I was nervous. I only played it maybe three or four times again mm-hmm <affirmative> thankless and scary. Yeah. But at one point, Tom Wolfpack comes up the back stairs and he sits on the piano mm-hmm <affirmative> and he was hilarious. Right. Yeah. And he looks down, he knows I'm a sub and he just perched himself and put his hand on top of the piano and purposely right over the top of my music. Like not for too long, but like knew like right where I was looking and kind of looked down at me and winked and, and like so funny and like mortifying all at the same time. Oh
Speaker 3 00:37:23 Yeah. So I remember Tom, but, but the other Billies that I had, the main one was John O. Hurley. Oh yeah. Mr. Peterman. Um, from, from Seinfeld, from Seinfeld and he, he was lovely. One of the loveliest people. Um, yeah. I that's a show I could play forever and ever, and
Speaker 0 00:37:42 Ever and fun for the band to get to interact with. Oh, oh
Speaker 3 00:37:45 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:37:46 The characters at least mm-hmm
Speaker 3 00:37:48 <affirmative> yep.
Speaker 0 00:37:49 Yeah. I remember the, um, Roxy, the time was like Paige O'Hara from mm-hmm <affirmative>
Speaker 3 00:37:56 Was
Speaker 0 00:37:56 Yeah. Front, uh, design on a design.
Speaker 3 00:37:59 No. Um, the one, uh, trading places or Paige was from the one where they trading spaces, trading spaces, trading
Speaker 0 00:38:07 Places, I think was, that was a movie. Eddie Murray.
Speaker 3 00:38:10 I don't that
Speaker 0 00:38:11 Good of a dancer maybe is, but yeah.
Speaker 3 00:38:14 Yeah. Trading spaces. I'm
Speaker 0 00:38:16 Sure you had a few roxies and Velma's
Speaker 3 00:38:18 Oh yeah. Do you have a favorite? The favorite? My favorite beat. My favorite, um, Roxy was Bianca and I think she's been on Broadway. Um, we've had a, a couple different Velma's and I, I don't remember their names, but they're, they've all been great. They really
Speaker 0 00:38:34 Have, oh, really? All of them, all of them. Every single one. That's it <laugh> such, such a
Speaker 3 00:38:42 Generous. Okay. I'm fine.
Speaker 0 00:38:43 Generous performer.
Speaker 3 00:38:44 <laugh> I don't wanna piss anybody
Speaker 0 00:38:46 Off. Oh I do. But that's that's later episodes right now. I'm trying to be like somewhat diplomatic and never. Um, do you have other favorite shows?
Speaker 3 00:38:55 Chicago and I, I do love playing wicked and Fosse. Those are my top three. Um, I once played thoroughly modern Millie and I enjoyed that show too. That was
Speaker 0 00:39:07 About the, well, those have some cool kind of period esque charts.
Speaker 3 00:39:11 Yes.
Speaker 0 00:39:11 Yes. That are great for resections and,
Speaker 3 00:39:14 And I've done gypsy twice and that that's fun as well.
Speaker 0 00:39:17 I've never gotten to play gypsy.
Speaker 3 00:39:19 Oh yeah. I did it
Speaker 0 00:39:20 At
Speaker 3 00:39:23 ATT it's a tree and at the Shakespeare, so.
Speaker 0 00:39:25 Okay. Wow. Those are big charts too. They
Speaker 3 00:39:28 Are
Speaker 0 00:39:29 Shakespeare. I know you had a pretty good size band. What
Speaker 3 00:39:33 It, yeah. It was three reads. Yeah. So that, yeah. Three reads, uh, maybe two Trump guys, three
Speaker 0 00:39:39 Trumpets kind of on stage
Speaker 3 00:39:41 For that. Yes we were mm-hmm
Speaker 0 00:39:42 <affirmative> like behind and up,
Speaker 3 00:39:44 Like yeah. Mm-hmm
Speaker 0 00:39:45 <affirmative> I saw it. Mm-hmm <affirmative>
Speaker 3 00:39:47 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:39:47 Trying to remember who was gypsy?
Speaker 3 00:39:50 I don't remember, but people really, really liked her. And then out at the jury, it was, um, it was CLE. It was Clelia blacker and I Cleo was my favorite. I, I really liked how she did
Speaker 0 00:40:01 It. Well, she's my favorite we're yeah. We've been friends for 30 years. Yeah. And she's only 37. I know. It's so weird. Um, yeah, that's a show I would love to do. I also saw, uh, E Fay Butler do it at Porchlight oh, a couple years ago. Oh
Speaker 3 00:40:18 Really? Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:40:18 Okay. Of course she was sort of born to play that role. She was, she mowed it down to.
Speaker 3 00:40:24 Okay.
Speaker 0 00:40:25 Um, excellent. Yeah. Well I think it's time to take a little break. Okay. And so Linda van Dyke and I will return right after the interval. Today's interval is brought to you by no one. Again, I have no sponsors, but Linda, my God, the
Speaker 3 00:41:00 Isn't it the most beautiful Trione you've ever heard. Oh,
Speaker 0 00:41:03 The devil's interval and in the Shamo register.
Speaker 3 00:41:07 My favorite clarinet
Speaker 0 00:41:08 Mm-hmm <affirmative> it's the only register. I know. <laugh> when I had to take instrumental classes in college, I played clarinet for like a quarter mm-hmm <affirmative> and the only thing I could do was like three notes in the Shamo register. Yes. I couldn't go over the break.
Speaker 3 00:41:22 Oh, I have some good exercises for that. <laugh>
Speaker 0 00:41:27 I was even worse on violin <laugh> I remember for my jury, I played, there was a frog.
Speaker 3 00:41:35 I didn't know. You pursued education.
Speaker 0 00:41:37 I have an education degree. You do? It doesn't seem like it
Speaker 3 00:41:39 Doesn't it. It does
Speaker 0 00:41:40 Not. Yeah. I have an instrumental education and a composition degree. Wow. All put to wonderful youth. Yes. Uh, somewhere somehow. But that was a, a different era. Yes. So welcome back. Yeah. Thank you. Um, I wanted to talk to you about DOR county, Wisconsin. I know that's something you and I have in common. We do. Tell me about what's your, um, status there these days?
Speaker 3 00:42:06 Well, during the pandemic, ironically enough, I purchased a condo up indoor county fish Creek to be
Speaker 0 00:42:16 Okay.
Speaker 3 00:42:17 Um, exact and, uh, my, my history, there goes way back. My boyfriend back in college days, he and I, uh, traveled up there together for actually he met, he told my me about going up there. And so my parents and my sister and I, we did a family vacation up there, loved it. Then he and I did many trips up there when we broke up, I, I thought, screw it. I don't wanna keep going. So I would go by myself and, um, it was a retreat for me and I just, I just love it up there. It, it speaks to me, it calms me, it rejuvenates me. Um, and uh, I had the great fortune of playing a show back in 2018, got at Penn players and lived up there for four weeks, I think, and then was supposed to do another show at, uh, uh, in 2020, obviously got canceled, like everything else, but I already had the Airbnb in place. So I went up and um, I kept the Airbnb found two other jobs so that I could pay my bills and realized I wanted to have a place up there. So I, while many others were struggling during the pandemic financially, I was very fortunate that I was in a place. I could pay off my condo here in Oak park, Illinois, and take on a brand new, um, mortgage up there.
Speaker 0 00:43:54 But so you're BI coastal now, right?
Speaker 3 00:43:56 A bit. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:43:57 I mean, you live here.
Speaker 3 00:43:58 People think I've moved up there. They're surprised when they see me here and I it's the opposite. I still live here.
Speaker 0 00:44:05 Okay. But at one point you were gonna move there
Speaker 3 00:44:07 Full time, right? I was, I was.
Speaker 0 00:44:08 So that was the story on
Speaker 3 00:44:09 The streets. Yeah, it was, that was, I think a gut reaction to, uh, to when my mother passed away in 2017 and I just wanted to mix things up in my life. And as it turned out that did not happen. And it was the best thing ever because it wasn't the right move for me at the time. This is a good fit for me right now. Will I end up there permanently? I don't know, but it's, it's this works right now.
Speaker 0 00:44:37 So for those of my two listeners who don't know where DOR county is, mm-hmm, <affirmative>, it's like five hours north straight north of Chicago. And it's what I call the thumb of Wisconsin.
Speaker 3 00:44:49 I call it that too. And people say, oh no, that's Michigan. That has the thumb. Okay. Wisconsin has one
Speaker 0 00:44:53 Too. Yeah. Michigan is a, a catcher's MIT. Yes. And, uh, Wisconsin is the fists, but with the thumb extended. Yes. So in the crook of the thumb is green bay mm-hmm <affirmative> and there door county is the peninsula or most of the peninsula? Yes. Um, between green bay and lake Michigan. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I, I call it like, it's like a new England fishing village only freshwater.
Speaker 3 00:45:17 Yeah. Well, there's often comparison to Cape Cod.
Speaker 0 00:45:20 Yes. It's
Speaker 3 00:45:21 The Cape Cod of the Midwest. It's
Speaker 0 00:45:24 Artsy. There's a lot of galleries. There's a lot of outdoor, um, hiking and activities. Boating of course. Um, my relationship there, I worked, uh, back in the day, I worked a lot at peninsula players. Mm-hmm <affirmative> um, which is, I think still built as the oldest continuous, um, summer theater with a resident company in the country.
Speaker 3 00:45:49 Oh, really? That I did not
Speaker 0 00:45:51 Know. Yeah. It's been around for quite a while, but, um, I did a first did a show there in the mid nineties and have been lucky enough to, I think have directed four shows and or music directed those, um, I've music directed a show. I've acted in a show. Oh, and yeah. So I've been up there at several different times of the year, the first show of the season I did, uh,
Speaker 3 00:46:18 We should do a show together up there.
Speaker 0 00:46:20 Of course we show the Sean and Linda show. Yes. The podcast in person. I'm sure it'll be a hit <laugh>. Um, in fact, I mean, they don't like it. Well, I don't know if they don't like it, but, um, when they built the new theater, which is almost 10 years ago now.
Speaker 3 00:46:35 Oh, really? Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:46:35 Okay. So when I was first there, it was the other,
Speaker 3 00:46:38 I think it's beautiful
Speaker 0 00:46:39 Pavilion. It's a beautiful theater, but I'm actually the first actor to ever appear on that stage. No, I'm not the first actor to speak,
Speaker 3 00:46:49 But to appear.
Speaker 0 00:46:50 I was the first we did the first play was masterclass.
Speaker 3 00:46:54 Okay.
Speaker 0 00:46:54 With Carmen, Roman as, um, Maria Callis and sh uh, stunning, like tour divorce. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, I mean, she's a tour divorce actress, anyhow, but that was where actress and role really met. So she was the first one to speak, but I was Manny Weinstein, the accompanist Uhhuh, you know, cuz it takes place in a musical masterclass. Yeah. So I was on stage the first one to enter ever
Speaker 3 00:47:21 Wow.
Speaker 0 00:47:21 Of the new peninsula players. Thank you very much. <laugh> and of course my career has soared since then, so, but I love the place and it's DOR county and it's sort of vibe it for me. You go up there and it takes a week or two to sort of settle into the different rhythm. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I guess that's why we get, you know, intoxicated with it.
Speaker 3 00:47:47 Yeah. It was interesting living there all last summer. Um, I, I worked too hard at my two jobs and then teaching online, I wasn't able to appreciate and do all the things that you go up there to do
Speaker 0 00:48:03 Because your jobs weren't musical jobs, they
Speaker 3 00:48:05 Were not,
Speaker 0 00:48:05 They were just surviving
Speaker 3 00:48:07 Sharks. Right? Yeah. And I love both of them. I, I have nothing against either one of them and I could even see myself doing them post music. Um, but I still had to pay bills and yes. Um, owning the two places, they pile up way faster. Um, but I, I, I worked too hard. I pushed and I, this summer I'm hoping to enjoy it more. So
Speaker 0 00:48:33 It is a, it's a beautiful place.
Speaker 3 00:48:36 It's stunning. It really is. And even just driving home from work at night, it, I could just feel everything release. It was, it was wonderful.
Speaker 0 00:48:48 Yeah. And when I was working at peninsula players, we lived there on campus. Yes. We had cabins and just walked up the hill
Speaker 3 00:48:55 Uhhuh <affirmative>
Speaker 0 00:48:57 Uh, after, you know, sitting by the, the camp fire after the show on the shores of uh, green bay. Yeah. A lot of great times, a lot of great people. Yeah. You know, remember the, the slogan or the written on the barn or it's written somewhere there love and
Speaker 3 00:49:14 Be loved love, be loved.
Speaker 0 00:49:15 Yep. Love and be loved. Mm-hmm <affirmative> a pretty good vibe to,
Speaker 3 00:49:19 It's a very good vibe and the people that work there are lovely. They really are.
Speaker 0 00:49:23 Yep. It's a, it's a special place. Very maybe someday again. Let's hope. It'd be great to go there together. Yes. So work on that please. Okay. I need an agent. <laugh> anyhow. So that's a cool cross section for
Speaker 3 00:49:37 Us. Yes. Yes. We have the Cubs. We have do county.
Speaker 0 00:49:40 Okay. And, and little El oh, Chicago, Chicago, the
Speaker 3 00:49:43 Chicago.
Speaker 0 00:49:43 Right. And Chicago, the city city. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I mean, technically you're in Oak park, so you're like a seven one eighter
Speaker 3 00:49:50 Where?
Speaker 0 00:49:50 7 0 8, 7 0 8. Yeah. What's 7 1 8, maybe LA somewhere 7 0 8. Yeah. Remember when there were only two area
Speaker 3 00:49:58 Codes I do. How Queens? I know. Well now with all of us having cell phones, it, it, it doesn't matter where you now I have my area code is St. Louis, cuz I, I was on my parents' plan. <laugh> actually I still am. <laugh>
Speaker 0 00:50:13 You and Steven Miller. Ugh. Don't get me started. Um, so that was what I wanted to follow up was your album then. So the album I heard was pop music. Mm-hmm <affirmative> and you singing, right? Yes. Mm-hmm <affirmative> sing lead.
Speaker 3 00:50:30 It was important to me, for the album to have a lot of horn writing on it. Um, and Carrie Deadman did all the horn arrangements, did a wonderful job of them and, but featured my baritone sex playing here's a phrase you'll never hear. It has a little hip hop, clarinet quartet thing on it. Um, you know, cause hip hop and clarinets. Exactly.
Speaker 0 00:50:55 Everyone thinks of that,
Speaker 3 00:50:56 But that was such great fun to play. And um, yeah. I, everything about putting it together was a wonderful,
Speaker 0 00:51:03 You know, what my favorite track was, what I, I don't know the song, but there's a point at which the cool woodwind section, um, riff mm-hmm <affirmative> like you stripped away the rest of the song and just
Speaker 3 00:51:15 Curd, the riff, uh, Uhhuh.
Speaker 0 00:51:16 So cool.
Speaker 3 00:51:17 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:51:18 Wow. And I'm like, of course a read player mm-hmm <affirmative> went for that arrangement cuz that was it just sort of stripped down the song and revealed the bones of it at the
Speaker 3 00:51:27 End. I'm pretty sure that was silver island towards the end. Yeah, that, that was a, and I think again, that was Carrie gunman's choice in his arranging and production to do that,
Speaker 0 00:51:39 But really cool to reveal that yeah. Like what the structure of the song was, but at the end and there's a lot of great arrangements on there and you have a great voice.
Speaker 3 00:51:48 Well, thank you.
Speaker 0 00:51:49 Do you, um, do you get to sing anymore?
Speaker 3 00:51:52 Not as much as I would like, um, I don't stay on top of keeping my voice in good shape either.
Speaker 0 00:51:57 Oh me either. I, if I had to sing now, I don't
Speaker 3 00:52:01 Know. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:52:03 I don't know what would come out if anything, but you have a, you have a whole career in church music.
Speaker 3 00:52:09 I do. Yeah. I never got trained in it. So again, my, my knowledge of, of the history of it and even kinda liturgical times of the year, I I've learned along the way, but
Speaker 0 00:52:23 I, well, if that was a prerequisite, most of us would be eliminated from ever working in music.
Speaker 3 00:52:28 So probably, but I lead three hand bell choirs at my church in Oak park, far Oaks Presbyterian church.
Speaker 0 00:52:35 Okay. So three bell
Speaker 3 00:52:36 Choirs, three bell choirs.
Speaker 0 00:52:38 What does that mean? Like kids
Speaker 3 00:52:39 Or medium? Well, I have a middle school, bell choir, high school and an adult.
Speaker 0 00:52:45 Okay. Yeah. And is there like a whole like repertoire you can buy of quire arrangements? Oh for sure. Or do you make your own or
Speaker 3 00:52:54 Oh no. Oh no. There are excellent arrangers out there. I've gotten to know who those people are.
Speaker 0 00:53:00 Yeah. Oh that's cool. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:53:01 How Sophia DSKY and Brenda Austin.
Speaker 0 00:53:04 Oh, names, names. <laugh> great. Um, how, how many people are we talking? One for every note,
Speaker 3 00:53:11 Two notes. Everybody has two notes on, on the keyboard and it's the standard, um, is three actives and you need 11 ringers for three actives. And if you're a keyboard player, it's very disconcerting to look at it at first because you're seeing all the music, but you just play these notes right there.
Speaker 0 00:53:35 Yeah. I'm not sure. I think I would freeze like, is that my right hand? No, my left hand. Oh, I missed it.
Speaker 3 00:53:41 Well, I have helped people like that by I color code all my music. I have spent countless hours color coding the music so that people can see which notes they do.
Speaker 0 00:53:53 Okay. Tell me more about that. How, how,
Speaker 3 00:53:57 Um,
Speaker 0 00:53:57 Is it on a staff
Speaker 3 00:53:58 It's on? Oh yeah. If I showed it to you, you would think it was a PA piece of piano music. Okay. Although it's, it's got more notes than your 10 fingers can play.
Speaker 0 00:54:07 Oh, have you heard me? I mean, I hit a lot of extra notes along the way, so I, I think I can hit more than 10.
Speaker 3 00:54:14 So if you're playing book one, that's, we're getting very detailed for our body.
Speaker 0 00:54:20 I'm curious. I, I always wondered how bell
Speaker 3 00:54:22 Players, so book one for me is, um, C and D in the base clef in the staff and your highest book, 11 is B and C above the staff in trouble clef. And I just, I color code blue and orange and pink and green <laugh>. And
Speaker 0 00:54:39 So when you lead a performance or conducted mm-hmm <affirmative>, do you actually like point to people? Is it too late if you point?
Speaker 3 00:54:50 Um, I I'll queue vaguely similar to an orchestra conductor would,
Speaker 0 00:54:55 But what are you saying? We con we queue vaguely
Speaker 3 00:54:59 <laugh>.
Speaker 0 00:54:59 I like to think I'm very, very, very clear, but go on,
Speaker 3 00:55:03 But their, their, their parts are, are coded and we've rehearsed enough. They know where to come in and I just, half the time they don't even need me. Um, sometimes I'm playing along with them and I'll, you know, kind of conduct, but it's, it's a real interesting.
Speaker 0 00:55:21 What do you mean playing you're playing bells too, right? Or you play a woodwind with them? No,
Speaker 3 00:55:25 No, no, no. I play bells with them.
Speaker 0 00:55:26 Do you mix mediums at
Speaker 3 00:55:27 All? I have, um, we've had a flute player play along with us. I've had, we sometimes will collaborate with the church choir and um, yeah, so I love the music and I love working with the people that ring, um, especially my high school kids.
Speaker 0 00:55:45 I love that. That's gotta be a book. The people that ring <laugh>
Speaker 3 00:55:49 Well, the fact that you've get 11 teenagers that are willing to come to a 45 minute rehearsal to ring hand bells, a miracle with all the other things that they have going on in their life. I think there's a piece of them that knows value in that. So, and this year I, I started not started, but I, uh, unity temple in Oak park, the Frank Lloyd Wright church. Okay. Um,
Speaker 0 00:56:16 So all the charts are slightly too short <laugh> and the roof leaks, but the arrangements are the same. How does that work?
Speaker 3 00:56:23 Um, <laugh> I don't know what has much to say to that. There's nothing to be said. Yeah. So, um, yeah, I led their bell choir this year. Um, they had lost their leader, um, to pancreatic cancer a couple years ago, right at the beginning of the pandemic and they were looking for someone. So I filled in with them. So it's been fun to do even more bell music with people.
Speaker 0 00:56:45 I think that's really cool.
Speaker 3 00:56:47 I, I enjoy it. I will say it's one of the highlights of, of music that I do now. Uh, it's very filling for me.
Speaker 0 00:56:54 How do you do that? If you're also have a show schedule eight shows a week, can you,
Speaker 3 00:57:00 Um, when I did a long running show, I would get a sub to do the Wednesday night shows because that's when my rehearsals are. Mm. If it was a two week run or something, then I would sub out of the bells and get somebody to cover for me there. Okay. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:57:20 Very cool. So let's go outside of music. Okay. Per moment. What do you do for fun?
Speaker 3 00:57:27 Oh my goodness. Um, I'm a crafter. I I've cross stitched over the years. I don't do quite as much as I used to. Um, and then a girlfriend of
Speaker 0 00:57:39 Mine on the window sill there. Yes. It's a cross-stitch by my mom, the red thing.
Speaker 3 00:57:43 Oh really? Should we show our audience? Yeah. Oh yeah. Well that's pretty,
Speaker 0 00:57:48 My mom used to do a lot of cross-stitch.
Speaker 3 00:57:50 Yeah. Oh, there's many pieces out there that I've done, um, as gifts. And
Speaker 0 00:57:56 Can you, can you still see that it's so tiny.
Speaker 3 00:58:00 Oh, oh yeah. Well, that's why I wear my readers. <laugh> um, I can't do it without them, but it, you definitely need good eyes for that. But I also do some felt work with, um, felted wool. I have a girlfriend, she and I make these trees together. We have a blast with that. Um, sadly I've gotten into playing games on my iPad that I think take up a little too much of my time that I'm trying to break the habit of,
Speaker 0 00:58:29 Oh, hello. All of us. Right.
Speaker 3 00:58:31 The pandemic. I'm blame it on that. Um, but I do try to get outside and walk more. Um, I don't know. I feel very uninteresting in this area here.
Speaker 0 00:58:41 Oh, please. I'm gonna draw out the interesting wind Vandyke here. Do you cook? Do you bake? Do you,
Speaker 3 00:58:49 You know, I, I do enjoy cooking, but I'm single and live alone and it's hard to do big stuff when it's just you. Exactly. And yes, I could freeze it, but then
Speaker 0 00:59:01 That's my dilemma. I love to bake. I got that from my mom. She could bake a pie at the drop of a hat. Mm-hmm <affirmative> literally bake a crust from, so I love to bake, but I only bake now when I'm giving it, most of it away. Yeah. To friends because otherwise I eat it.
Speaker 3 00:59:17 The whole thing. Well, my 88 year old father who still lives in St. Louis on his own, um, he relies on my sister and me to make meals for him. And we freeze them. That's where I find it's fun to be creative. I'll find recipes. Will it be something different for him to enjoy? And I, I love doing that and I don't know why I don't do it for me.
Speaker 0 00:59:38 Interesting. So, so you and I are lucky. I have both of my parents still living mm-hmm <affirmative> my mom is about to turn 86 and my dad is 80. Will he be 88 in the fall?
Speaker 3 00:59:50 My dad just turned 88. Mm-hmm
Speaker 0 00:59:51 <affirmative> a lot of challenges there. Yeah. I mean friends who are our age, who still have their parents. Yeah. A camp of lucky, but there's so many challenges with growing old and growing old in this country. Mm-hmm <affirmative> Ugh. Yeah. That's like another seven drink conversation. I'm
Speaker 3 01:00:11 Afraid. <laugh> well, and you and I live far away from our parents. And
Speaker 0 01:00:15 So somewhat intentionally <laugh> at least at a certain point in my life. Yeah. You know, my parents still live in brainer, Minnesota, where I grew up. Yeah. And just this fall, we moved them into senior living. Okay. They lived in the same house for 56 years. Wow. And so my siblings and I are in the process of like selling the house and getting the parents. And you know, if it hadn't been for the pandemic, we would've moved them a year earlier.
Speaker 3 01:00:45 Yeah.
Speaker 0 01:00:47 Probably
Speaker 3 01:00:47 We're trying to decide when that's gonna happen with my dad. We, we wanna keep him in the house as long as possible. I think he does best there, but memory stuff is starting to
Speaker 0 01:00:58 Yeah. And my sister lives in Seattle, my brother lives in the twin cities and I'm in Chicago. We don't live there. Right. And it just became unsafe. Yes. Everyone would love for them to stay at home. Right, right. Including them. Mm-hmm <affirmative> but it wasn't safe.
Speaker 3 01:01:15 Yeah. We're hoping that we make that decision before it gets too unsafe. So yeah. Every time we visit, we take stock.
Speaker 0 01:01:24 I think my siblings and I, again, we agree, we sort of, we outlasted how long it should have been. Yeah. But it just, you know, we, weren't gonna move people in a pandemic right. Into a nursing home right. Where people were, you know? Yeah. Even now that's, that's challenging and it's heartbreaking. We just had to take my parents' dog away from them. Oh
Speaker 3 01:01:48 No.
Speaker 0 01:01:50 A lot of angst there. But, um, they, we had an arrangement where they could bring their dog mm-hmm <affirmative> but the place was short staffed and the place is big and it was hard to get the dog out and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So we had to find a new home for him, but we did. Oh, good. My brother did like Yemen's work and found this perfect guy who likes dogs and had one used to have one just like barky, a little Shitzu. Aww. But so hard, you know? Yeah. Another small, um, right. Uh, stab, I guess you feel as you get older and
Speaker 3 01:02:27 My dad has a dog and we, we think it's, it's part of what keeps him on a schedule. Yes. He, it's something for him to take care of. Were your parents supportive of your, your music career?
Speaker 0 01:02:39 Yes. Uh, my dad, so were mine and, and based on nothing. Yeah. Like, but so my dad was a, the head high school guidance counselor mm-hmm <affirmative> um, where I went to school and my mom ended up being, um, a regular substitute teacher at the high school mm-hmm <affirmative>. But, um, aside from our church music, really no basis for artistic endeavor yeah. In our DNA. And so my sister and I were both in the arts, she was more of an actor than me. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, but we both played instruments. And my older brother played instruments and sang in the choir. And it's really weird. My dad, big sports, he coached football, coached, baseball, really into sport. He referee mm-hmm <affirmative> like the joke was when we were growing up, you know, having dinner at home at five 30, whatever where's dad. Oh, he's in Seka, he's reffing a game. He was always refereeing a game or doing something. But so he has no upbringing in the arts and the, I never felt questioned like, what are you doing? Being choir and banged. Yeah. And being in the play and, uh, kind of remarkable. I'm sure most of it just bewildered him.
Speaker 3 01:03:56 Yeah. Well, and I, when I said I wanted to go to college for it and was never questioned about that. And my mom was wonderful about saving money and I had zero college debt coming out of college. And, but when I got to, to school at DePaul, I ran into all these people whose parents weren't in favor of them doing it. And it was so such a foreign thought to me, I'm like, well, why not?
Speaker 0 01:04:23 Yeah. By the time I went to college, it was a given for me. Yeah. You know, I was like, you, I, I, at a certain point in, well, when I first took up the trumpet, I know in, in elementary school I was last chair. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, I, I didn't like to practice, you know, and I never really liked to practice. And then in junior high I sort of started getting better and, and eventually sort of ascended into first chair mm-hmm <affirmative> and then I, you know, auditioned and got into the top symphonic band in Brainerd, Minnesota, you know? And so you start to realize you have a skill that others don't. And, and so I was like, you, I sort of rose up in the local ranks and became, you know, whatever where the local stars or the high school. Yeah. You know, heavy weights or whatever it was. So I was, I knew I was going to school for music, something, I didn't really know what mm-hmm <affirmative> I didn't ever really intend to be a professional trumpet player. Mm-hmm <affirmative> even though in college, I mean, I played,
Speaker 3 01:05:23 Where did you go to college?
Speaker 0 01:05:25 University of Minnesota. Oh, okay. Go, go first. <laugh> yeah. Like I said, right. We always lose, but I wanted to go a, I went to I'm from a small town. Mm-hmm <affirmative> I wanted to go to the big city. I wanted a big school. I wanted big opportunities. I wanted to get lost. Yeah. You know, a little bit, uh, um, I'm not sure how much more intentional it was than that.
Speaker 3 01:05:48 Yeah.
Speaker 0 01:05:49 But I, I just knew, I always knew I was sort of a city person and I wanted, um, bigger.
Speaker 3 01:05:56 Did you apply to more schools than that?
Speaker 0 01:05:58 Oh, no. In fact, I don't think I applied to college until the spring time of the year before I was going to college. You're kidding. And my dad was the high school guidance counselor. I think it was finally like, well, you better fill out that application for the U cuz in Minnesota. It's just the U the U you know, you went to the U um, yeah, it was ridiculous. Wow. I just sort of like, oh yeah. I guess I suppose I should apply. I mean, I had good grades. Yeah. You know, of course, listen, this is the seventies in high school right here was my schedule my senior year, first, first period. I think maybe I had to take a, an English course or something. Second period. Um, maybe it was study hall. Then I had choir fourth period was banned and fifth and sixth hour was drama. <laugh> how did I learn anything? I mean, we got, we had really good high powered programs and all those things really lucky in the middle of Northern Minnesota, but like, how did I learn anything? I took like one math class.
Speaker 3 01:07:05 That's my, what my senior year was too. I think I had math or English and history. And that was it. It was orchestra and wind ensemble and jazz band. And I accompanied the choir and I had one period where I was student aid to the band director.
Speaker 0 01:07:21 Exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:07:22 And get this, I was valedictorian with a schedule like that.
Speaker 0 01:07:27 Amazing. You
Speaker 3 01:07:28 Could not do that now. See?
Speaker 0 01:07:30 Yeah. Well how would, yeah. Well, but you're special, but like that was, but yeah. So in the seventies, mm-hmm, <affirmative>, you know, we didn't have require, we took like home EC. That was so quaint. Oh, we made, we learned how to make muffins today. And the girls would take like O a like auto engine repair class
Speaker 3 01:07:48 Can kids today are, they're so stressed out about all these classes that they have to take. And <laugh>, that was not my experience at
Speaker 0 01:07:56 All. No. And, and we probably aired on the side of crunchy granola. Yeah. Like funness, Uhhuh <affirmative>. But like, I think I came out of it. Okay.
Speaker 3 01:08:04 I think we did. Okay.
Speaker 0 01:08:05 You know, I was prepared for some things in life and
Speaker 3 01:08:08 Yeah. So,
Speaker 0 01:08:10 Interesting valedictorian.
Speaker 3 01:08:12 Yeah. I, I, I don't tell that too often here I am telling it, you know, to the world, to the 15 people that are yes,
Speaker 0 01:08:20 Exactly. No, all 15.
Speaker 3 01:08:21 No, but it's yeah. I don't know that I really deserved it, but
Speaker 0 01:08:27 Hey. Yeah, you did. Cuz you did it well.
Speaker 3 01:08:29 Yeah.
Speaker 0 01:08:30 But yeah. Isn't it crazy? The I'm glad I'm not a kid. No. These days, no. The amount of media and stuff coming at you is, is overwhelming. Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:08:41 And I they're all applying to like 12 and 15 schools. I, I applied to three, which at the time felt like a lot. And I think I'm one of three people from my high school that left Missouri.
Speaker 0 01:08:51 So you came out of DePaul with no debt,
Speaker 3 01:08:54 Correct?
Speaker 0 01:08:55 Wow. Yeah. I mean,
Speaker 3 01:08:57 Well, I was an RA for three years, so that paid for my room and board. Okay. And mom had enough saved to pay all the other stuff, so yeah. And then I got my master's because I had a, a TA.
Speaker 0 01:09:09 Oh
Speaker 3 01:09:09 Wow. Yeah. I was very fortunate. I know. Yeah. I'm in jazz composition again, the air quotes, because I just really wanted to write pop music. So
Speaker 0 01:09:20 Mm-hmm <affirmative> so here's my last thing I want to talk to you about. Okay. What would you say to people, young people who aspire to do what you do or what we do, do you, do we have any advice from our lofty position that would help people?
Speaker 3 01:09:39 I currently have a student, um, he's a junior very, very good musician who wants to get into playing musicals. I hope that there will be musicals out there for him to play. Yeah. The things that I say to my kids now are you really need to come in with a great attitude. Yes. You need to be a great player, but you need to be respectful show up on time. Um, things that seem so obvious. And again, I'm, I'm saying things that don't have to do with music, but I, I be prepared with your music, um, listen to what's going on around you. Um,
Speaker 0 01:10:22 It all has to do with music. It, it maybe it's reverse the discipline of music. Yes. And the skills, you know, and the prep you has prepared me for life. Absolutely. I mean, I don't think I'd have any discipline if I hadn't had to learn music, deliver it, you know, music. Well,
Speaker 3 01:10:42 This young man, that's my student talk about the tables turning. He played for the high school musical. And I subbed for him because he had something else going on and I was happy to do it. And I, I got a, had a, it was great fun when I sat and audited, which is what we do. Yes. I don't care what it is. You, you go in, you watch what the conductor's doing. I wanted to go in and do the book justice. Uh, we, we had a talk about how he played it and we talked, you know, cutoffs, they matter. Um, he, he didn't have some of the rhythms. Right. He did a great job. He's a really, I, he did a lot of things. Correct. But I'm his teacher. And I was trying to tell him all the things and, and share with him too, that when you do a musical, all the little details they matter and you have to watch. And so,
Speaker 0 01:11:39 I mean, that's probably true in any genre mm-hmm <affirmative> but the thing about musical theater is then you throw in the wild card of there's actors, mm-hmm <affirmative> and people,
Speaker 3 01:11:50 And there's tech stuff up there
Speaker 0 01:11:51 That can, and there's moving scenery that may or may not be working right. When the event might be really, really long this night or not that, so there's another element or two. That mean the music has to be even that much more prepared. Right. And technically proficient. Yeah. Along with everything else. I, I think that's what I love about it. Yeah. It's like all elements of art, visual, and audio and everything else coming together. And how, how does it come together? Yeah, it's a miracle.
Speaker 3 01:12:22 And I, I think also having an appreciation for all styles of music. I had a student 15 years ago who just oozed, jazz and funk and all that kind of music. But I tried, nah, I tried, I, I told him how important it was to learn classical music as well. And he had such an open mind about it that he dug into a saxophone concerto and won the concerto competition. And I, I take such great pride in knowing that whatever he's doing now, he has that foundation of stuff and an appreciation for anything that he goes out to hear or play.
Speaker 0 01:13:06 I mean, that's thrilling, right. As a teacher, it
Speaker 3 01:13:08 Is
Speaker 0 01:13:09 A, a student that was open to it and capable of it.
Speaker 3 01:13:12 Yes. And loved it.
Speaker 0 01:13:13 They don't always go hand in hand. No,
Speaker 3 01:13:15 No, no. You know, and I use him as an example to my current students, especially when I feel a student who's resisting something I'm trying to teach them. It's like stay open to all of it.
Speaker 0 01:13:27 Yeah. That's my advice. When I, when people come to the edge of the pit and go, I wanna do what you do. Mm-hmm <affirmative> and I always say, uh, somewhat cynically, but mostly realistically, if you can do anything else, do that. Yeah. <laugh> because this is hard. This is it's
Speaker 3 01:13:44 Hard.
Speaker 0 01:13:45 It's called show biz mm-hmm <affirmative> and shows are really fun. That's 5%. Mm-hmm <affirmative> the biz part is like 95%. And most of that is pretty crappy.
Speaker 3 01:13:57 Yeah. It's, it's not an easy way to make a living. No, but I've, I've been able to do it. And I feel so fortunate, the variety of things that I've been able to do. Um, and if it were to all come to a screeching halt, now it would be okay because I've, I have all these wonderful memories of stuff that I've done.
Speaker 0 01:14:16 Yeah. I feel the same way. Yeah. I mean, you do get really special access and experience and all kinds of stuff when you're in shows
Speaker 3 01:14:25 Very much.
Speaker 0 01:14:26 Do you have a, um, any sort of, um, goals that you would still kind of like to get a chance to do in the world of music or even outside of that?
Speaker 3 01:14:41 If there were a way for me to get the songs of my CD, I need to figure out how to do it. It's so easy. Now I Spotify or something to get that music out there. I think it's still relevant and quality.
Speaker 0 01:14:56 Okay. You know what? We're gonna do it. We are because I'm learning now to podcast. Okay. And one of the cool things on podcast is you always have to say, so listen to us on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast. Right. And we're gonna post links.
Speaker 3 01:15:11 Oh yeah. To
Speaker 0 01:15:12 Linda's music. I mean, I have no idea how to do this, but I will, I'll figure it out. Okay. We're gonna post a picture of us doing this. Okay. And links to your CD. Okay. Which we'll figure out a way or where that, where that lives. Okay. Cause we're learning together. I mean, we can still learn new things. Yes we,
Speaker 3 01:15:30 Yes we can. Yes we can. I
Speaker 0 01:15:31 Hope I can. So yeah, we'll do that.
Speaker 3 01:15:34 I just to, to share the music. Yeah. I have no grand designs of being the pop star. I thought I was gonna be at the age of 16. No, but, but the music I think is to
Speaker 0 01:15:43 Share it. Yeah. To share it and to have it be available. Right. It should be in this world. So yeah. Thank you. We'll do that. I'm so glad. This has been so fun. I hope you've enjoyed it too.
Speaker 3 01:15:53 I have had a blast. Thank you for asking me to be your first guest.
Speaker 0 01:15:56 It's uh, thrill. We'll see. Both of our listeners will tell us how we did. Oh, we did. <laugh> all right, everybody. Thanks for checking in on Chicago musician. And please tell all your friends, if you liked it. And don't tell anybody if you didn't and um, come check back again for our next exciting guest on Chicago musician. I'm your host, Sean skel.
